http://www.soundclick.com/util/streamM3U.m3u?ID=1436022&q=Hi

"the federal minimum wage law is not a socialist idea; it's just a good one'"

there are so many variables to take into consideration with minimum wage....however if there was no mininum wage...would workers be paid more? No, its a minimum because wage rates would be lower than that. Without mininum wage would there be more employment? Well in the shortrun that would be true, however, with higher wages, come more productive workers...These workers create new jobs for other workers, and possibly fill the spots of the lost jobs from a minumum wage rate in the first place. Originally economist viewed unemployment as a surplus of labor, not a defecit of jobs, hence the conservatives unwillingness to increase minumum wage, increase the supply of labour. They should however take into consideration that more productive workers will be highered leading to more job creation.

Re; DotheStu

"That depends on the job. If a manager has to pay high wages, he might not be able to afford to pay additional workers. Also, with some jobs there is only so much "work" that can be done (cashiers, stockers, etc.). If these workers are more productive, it would lead to less jobs overall, not more."

The buisnesses make more money thus they expand, and employ more people. Thats how it works, your thinking of individual workers, you cant do that.

In terms of sustainable wage. One is able to abtain a life in which he wont have to borrow money just to feed himself.

Re:Dothestu

can do that, because it presents a problem. Stores only have a certain amount of shelf space. Let's say five workers can restock a department store overnight. They work for eight hours and all of the shelves are full at the end of their shift. At that point, there is no more room for merchandise in the store. Let's say the store hired five more workers...they would then have ten people stocking shelves overnight, and they would finish the job in half the time. Each worker would only receive half of the pay because they worked for half of the hours.

But then the buisness will expand, there willl be extensions from the building etc...which will lead to more job creation. Thats job growth

"The problem is also there with cashiers. Let's say a fast food restaurant gets 30 customers per hour. Let's say the restaurant has two cashiers, and they can comfortably deal with that many customers...the customers never have to wait in line for more than a minute or two. If they hire two more cashiers, it won't automatically make 30 more customers come to the restaurant. The demand just isn't there."

Do the stu

with all due respect to everyone........ No one is taking into consideration what happens when people are paid more. They spend more. More cunsumable income means more spending. Not to mention that since they have to pay more, they will get more productive people, which in turn will lead to even more growth. Ceilings create shortages....... Floors create surpluses..

"Minimum wage laws are simply a form of price control, in this case, a control on the price of labor." Thus creating a shortage of available jobs. "

"Regarding ceilings and floors: my point was that the minimum wage creates a ceiling on the available jobs in the market (there is only so much work to be done), and thus a shortage thereof. In my illustration above, you see how that shortage is not just short term, but is perpetuated by the lack of increase in demand/production and therefore jobs."

actually mininum wage is a price floor.....ceilings create surpluses.. floors create shortages. It doesnt create a ceilings on the available jobs that is an outlandish claim. It is a price floor for the price of labour. And my point is that with increased productivity from higher paid workers. With consumable income rising. There will actually be job growth. Again people take into consideration the short run and dont consider what happens when other things come into effect. And the people that detirmine mininum wage are not career politicians. They are economists.

"I have considered what happens when people are paid more (though I deleted my comments to post links; a mistake?), but I think you are concentrating too hard on this particular piece of the picture. Yes people who have more money in their pockets will likely spend more, however, when people lose jobs due to the minimum wage, there will be fewer of them doing it.

"bbkane careful with your question about whether the raise to $7something being "real or nominal." it really makes it seem like you're just throwing in terms you don't know how to define."

real wages are those adjusted for inflation......I assumed people knew that....sorry

"This is called unemployment. Now, what happens in the market when goods are at a surplus? The price drops. So the price of labor would just drop to adjust for the surplus... if the minimum wage did not block that adjustment."

"How long does that aggregate rise in demand take to materialize? Remember, Fred's clock is ticking, he needs to eat. Are we to sacrifice Fred in the short term for the benefit of the economy in the long term? I thought the minimum wage hike was intended to help the low-end workers; Fred feels screwed. Are we to support Fred in the meantime?"

Brother al

TABS ARE THE DEVIL figure it out by ear! figuring out songs by ear is one of the things that people overlook but is one of the most important things they should learn.

Brother al

Steve and Kirk are Satrianis generation hes just leaps and bounds above one of them. the other is really good with him :)